Hastings Supporters Forum - 100% Unofficial!

Members Login
Username 
 
Password 
    Remember Me  
Hastings United Supporters Club → Hastings United Fans Forum → Hastings Supporters Forum → Not so good news from the Observer (except for Sam Cruttwell)
 

Topic: Not so good news from the Observer (except for Sam Cruttwell)

Post Info
BigCliff
Senior Member
Status: Offline
Posts: 157
Date:
Not so good news from the Observer (except for Sam Cruttwell)
Permalink  
 

A Hastings United footballer has been invited for a trial with a Premier League club.

 

Sam Cruttwell, who only turned 17 last month, has been asked to spend a week with Hull City, although the dates have yet to be confirmed as the player is still in full-time education.

United manager Terry White said: “I’m absolutely chuffed about it. He’s a good lad and a good player. I’ve put him in for five games and he’s been absolutely brilliant for me.”

In a busy week at The Pilot Field, defender Sean Kelly has told White he is taking a break from football and is set to try his hand at boxing.

“He said it’s nothing to do with playing under me, he had already made his mind up under the previous management that he wasn’t enjoying it,” White said. “He had enjoyed me being back in charge, but he had already made a commitment to do it while the previous incumbents were in place.”

Another defender Josh Jirbandey has been the subject of a seven-day approach from higher grade Kingstonian.

White said: “My gut feeling is he might go because it’s a higher standard, but is it worth going up for four weeks (until he returns to university in California)? He’s got to establish himself in the team and by the time he does that it might be time to leave.”

One player definitely leaving is midfielder Ronnie Dolan, who has gone to Ashford United.

“He said he got a bit disillusioned in the past couple of months and even though he played for me in the last couple of games, he felt he didn’t do himself justice,” White said. “He’s a great lad, but it just hasn’t worked out for him unfortunately.”

Kenny Pogue, who White described as “exceptional” in the 4-0 win at Redhill on Wednesday night, is away for the games away to Tooting & Mitcham United tomorrow (Saturday) and at home to Chipstead on Monday night.

What’s more, Sam Adams (groin) and Ben Judge (thigh) are rated 50-50, and Matt Darby thinks he might have broken a rib. On the plus side, Bailo Camara and Danny Ellis are set to come back in.



-- Edited by BigCliff on Friday 28th of February 2014 08:42:35 AM



-- Edited by BigCliff on Friday 28th of February 2014 08:43:14 AM

__________________
sindy
Senior Member
Status: Offline
Posts: 102
Date:
RE: Not so good news from the Observer (except for Sam Cruttwell)
Permalink  
 
good luck to young sam, I hope a week is long enough for them to see the quality he has and the massive potential too.

__________________
FatherXmas
Guru
Status: Offline
Posts: 700
Date:
Not so good news from the Observer (except for Sam Cruttwell)
Permalink  
 

Maybe Terry will give some of the younger lads a game. Its a big step up but some of them that I saw on Monday looked capable of first team football. After Wednesday night's performance I am feeling more positive.

Good luck to Sam, he deserves his chance.



-- Edited by FatherXmas on Friday 28th of February 2014 11:35:29 AM

__________________

Steve Thorpe
MrLiamWillis
Senior Member
Status: Offline
Posts: 392
Date:
RE: Not so good news from the Observer (except for Sam Cruttwell)
Permalink  
 
Good boy Sam!

__________________
Liam Willis
BertNEC
Guru
Status: Offline
Posts: 1899
Date:
RE: Not so good news from the Observer (except for Sam Cruttwell)
Permalink  
 
Great chance for Sam ! Good Luck !

__________________
A foreign supporter !
Pat
Guru
Status: Offline
Posts: 513
Date:
RE: Not so good news from the Observer (except for Sam Cruttwell)
Permalink  
 
Absolutely thrilled for Sam, but as for the rest of it - just sums up a lot about our season and forgive me for ranting about it.we now seem to be reaping what was sown under the previous regime- A damn good CB wanting to get his face punched about instead, key injuries and unavailable players and little depth to cover. I was encouraged by the Under 21s on Monday too but dont think we can blend more than a couple in without it affecting our performance. Hope im wrong but timing not great here



__________________

Gooaaaalllllllll

 
Lenny The Lion
Guru
Status: Offline
Posts: 1735
Date:
RE: Not so good news from the Observer (except for Sam Cruttwell)
Permalink  
 
I think we should have faith in Terry on this one, I think if JJ goes it would be pointless, he goes back to America next month so why go for such a short space of time? It just doesn't make sense. Not encouraging about Irish but I knew he wasn't happy under John Maggs I'd like to see him see out the season but if he's not enjoying his football then you can't blame him. One thing though no one can fault his commitment he's always been there and even went out of his way and thanked supporters in the hotel that made the journey to Guernsey.
I'm not surprised Sam has got a trial at a pro club he's had offers a number of times before including an England schools trial but has been injured to take the various clubs up on the offer. I hope he does well he really has come along leaps and bounds since I saw him as an U15 player.


__________________
MrLiamWillis
Senior Member
Status: Offline
Posts: 392
Date:
RE: Not so good news from the Observer (except for Sam Cruttwell)
Permalink  
 
We keep being told that we have the budget to be promoted this season, but if Sean is going to peruse boxing, there could be a gap in the centre backs now. Hoping that this still isn't the case however. If I can, I might try to get told of Sam Cruttwell in the imminent future for a programme interview.

__________________
Liam Willis
johnw
Guru
Status: Offline
Posts: 1885
Date:
Not so good news from the Observer (except for Sam Cruttwell)
Permalink  
 

Let me get this right. Sam may be of  for a trial next week (great news by the way!) Dolan has gone, Kelly retired, JJ possibly off (TW thinks he will go), Kenny unavailable for 2 games, Sam Adams and Ben Judge doubtful and Darby with suspected broken rib! So I am guessing Terry will be playing the new 1-7-2 formation with Henson at the back? 

Is there ever a week in the life of Hastings United FC when there isn't some kind of crisis?



-- Edited by johnw on Friday 28th of February 2014 01:55:28 PM

__________________
Lenny The Lion
Guru
Status: Offline
Posts: 1735
Date:
RE: Not so good news from the Observer (except for Sam Cruttwell)
Permalink  
 
johnw wrote:

Let me get this right. Sam may be of  for a trial next week (great news by the way!) Dolan has gone, Kelly retired, JJ possibly off (TW thinks he will go), Kenny unavailable for 2 games, Sam Adams and Ben Judge doubtful and Darby with suspected broken rib! So I am guessing Terry will be playing the new 1-7-2 formation with Henson at the back? 

Is there ever a week in the life of Hastings United FC when there isn't some kind of crisis?



-- Edited by johnw on Friday 28th of February 2014 01:55:28 PM

 Maybe I should of delayed my post about the new scarves till next week John.  



__________________
Pat
Guru
Status: Offline
Posts: 513
Date:
Not so good news from the Observer (except for Sam Cruttwell)
Permalink  
 

I still want Mine Baz.

 

None of this mess is particularly of Terrys making, but agree with John - the back is going to look interesting.Cant Irish be persuaded to stay on a couple more games?



-- Edited by Pat on Friday 28th of February 2014 03:36:40 PM

__________________

Gooaaaalllllllll

 
powels22
Veteran Member
Status: Offline
Posts: 69
Date:
RE: Not so good news from the Observer (except for Sam Cruttwell)
Permalink  
 

Rumour has it that it's the present management players are not that happy with, don't believe everything you hear about the previous management.



__________________
johnw
Guru
Status: Offline
Posts: 1885
Date:
RE: Not so good news from the Observer (except for Sam Cruttwell)
Permalink  
 

As I said, always a crisis at Hastings whoever is in charge.



__________________
BertNEC
Guru
Status: Offline
Posts: 1899
Date:
RE: Not so good news from the Observer (except for Sam Cruttwell)
Permalink  
 
powels22 wrote:

Rumour has it that it's the present management players are not that happy with, don't believe everything you hear about the previous management.

     Powels, which players are you referring to ? I think a few of them are injured and 2 can step up to a higher level. Maybe Kelly ? Is it not always so that players who don't play complain ? Seems that Terry just get things sorted out ?!



__________________
A foreign supporter !
rev59
Senior Member
Status: Offline
Posts: 199
Date:
RE: Not so good news from the Observer (except for Sam Cruttwell)
Permalink  
 

SOS TO JOHNW.

JOHN, I NEED YOUR PHONE URGENTLY PLEASE.



__________________
ChrisB
Guru
Status: Offline
Posts: 1437
Date:
RE: Not so good news from the Observer (except for Sam Cruttwell)
Permalink  
 
So the laughing stock that is Hastings United takes another ridiculous twist, the fact that they have to say
It was the previous management etc suggests this is an easy party to blame. The club is a shambles and whatever the reason (and a few of us have a good idea of who is causing the shambles) we are going nowhere the club needs a clearout from right at the top to the bottom. We need good footballing people running and managing our team, and as John Maggs said we deserve better.

__________________
Pat
Guru
Status: Offline
Posts: 513
Date:
RE: Not so good news from the Observer (except for Sam Cruttwell)
Permalink  
 
There were hardly any players brought in under the previous management . Just stating a fact. The chickens are now coming home unfortunately but for me personally a clear out from top to bottom as you say - in my opinion is not the right answer. It takes time to build. Don't think we are a laughing stock either- disappointing league position but nevertheless still on play off contention.

__________________

Gooaaaalllllllll

 
ChrisB
Guru
Status: Offline
Posts: 1437
Date:
RE: Not so good news from the Observer (except for Sam Cruttwell)
Permalink  
 
Pat we are a laughing stock, the way we keep recycling managers and players, 2 managers at least a season, high admission prices, most expensive food in the division, I hate to think what state the club would have been in if the FA cup run hadn't occurred. The negatives associated with the club far outweigh the positives, unless you can tell me otherwise.

__________________
johnw
Guru
Status: Offline
Posts: 1885
Date:
RE: Not so good news from the Observer (except for Sam Cruttwell)
Permalink  
 

Sent you a PM Rev. Let me guess, DW wants it so he can offer me a job.biggrin

 



__________________
Hamilton
Senior Member
Status: Offline
Posts: 113
Date:
RE: Not so good news from the Observer (except for Sam Cruttwell)
Permalink  
 
FatherXmas wrote:

Maybe Terry will give some of the younger lads a game. Its a big step up but some of them that I saw on Monday looked capable of first team football. After Wednesday night's performance I am feeling more positive.

Good luck to Sam, he deserves his chance.



-- Edited by FatherXmas on Friday 28th of February 2014 11:35:29 AM

 100% agree. That's one of the reasons for having an U21 squad. Also wish all the best to Sam, I think he has got what it takes.



__________________
conquest1
Senior Member
Status: Offline
Posts: 334
Date:
RE: Not so good news from the Observer (except for Sam Cruttwell)
Permalink  
 
Just when I thought the squad was looking stronger.Just when I thought they were playing better(last two games),we now seem to be in some sort of crisis.If there is discontent in the team I haven't seen it on the pitch lately.

__________________
bingbangbong
Newbie
Status: Offline
Posts: 1
Date:
RE: Not so good news from the Observer (except for Sam Cruttwell)
Permalink  
 
powels22 wrote:

Rumour has it that it's the present management players are not that happy with, don't believe everything you hear about the previous management.




Rumour has it that you have an office at the club powells22 but like you said don't believe everything you hear!

Everyone is entitled to an opinion but that is just trouble making from a someone that should no better!
nonodisbeliefdisbelief

__________________
Peter R
Senior Member
Status: Offline
Posts: 499
Date:
RE: Not so good news from the Observer (except for Sam Cruttwell)
Permalink  
 
great for sam think he been really good since terry got him in playing in side only 17 but looks a lot more mature. bad news re kelly as he has been one of good points this season but his form not good toward end of maggs rein so maybe he did not like playing under maggs. but why go now hope he stay til end of season. dont make sense if jirbandey go if its true he goes back to usa and sorry but dont think he would get in the kingstonian side as not as good as he was last season.
have not seen any signs of players being unhappy with terry and if anythink the players look more up for it than with maggs although performances are only slightly better except up front where we are much better. Chris agree food is expensive but is best in this league by long way espcially the tasty burgers and chips and think they worth the money

__________________
Pat
Guru
Status: Offline
Posts: 513
Date:
RE: Not so good news from the Observer (except for Sam Cruttwell)
Permalink  
 
Chris. What on earth has the price of chips got to do with the playing side? Only a laughing stock in your opinion. The problem I have believing you is that you are so obvious in your disdain for the club that you have no balance in your opinion.

__________________

Gooaaaalllllllll

 
Pat
Guru
Status: Offline
Posts: 513
Date:
RE: Not so good news from the Observer (except for Sam Cruttwell)
Permalink  
 
Bing bang bong. Who do you think Powels is then? Just interested

__________________

Gooaaaalllllllll

 
Lenny The Lion
Guru
Status: Offline
Posts: 1735
Date:
RE: Not so good news from the Observer (except for Sam Cruttwell)
Permalink  
 
Ironically I saw this prior to reading ChrisB post........thefootballneutral.com/2013/10/06/the-football-neutral-match-five-hastings-united-vs-brentwood-town/

__________________
steviesteve00
Senior Member
Status: Offline
Posts: 364
Date:
RE: Not so good news from the Observer (except for Sam Cruttwell)
Permalink  
 

Tbf the food not best in league, if went to chipstead first game of season that was best food by a mile 



__________________
MrLiamWillis
Senior Member
Status: Offline
Posts: 392
Date:
RE: Not so good news from the Observer (except for Sam Cruttwell)
Permalink  
 
The food has nothing to do with departures of players!

__________________
Liam Willis
BertNEC
Guru
Status: Offline
Posts: 1899
Date:
RE: Not so good news from the Observer (except for Sam Cruttwell)
Permalink  
 
Lenny The Lion wrote:

Ironically I saw this prior to reading ChrisB post........thefootballneutral.com/2013/10/06/the-football-neutral-match-five-hastings-united-vs-brentwood-town/

 A very nice piece to read !

I really hope the guy will come over again sometimes !



__________________
A foreign supporter !
MrLiamWillis
Admin
Status: Offline
Posts: 1779
Date:
RE: Not so good news from the Observer (except for Sam Cruttwell)
Permalink  
 
Great article there, hadn't seen that before.

The way I read the observer article is that there is no date set yet for Sam and if it has to happen when he's not at school then the earliest would be Easter in about 5 weeks.

Josh will still be playing today I assume as the 7 day letter wouldn't have been completed yet even if he does go.

I trust Terry to be able to sign the players required to replace anyone who leaves though.

__________________
johnw
Guru
Status: Offline
Posts: 1885
Date:
RE: Not so good news from the Observer (except for Sam Cruttwell)
Permalink  
 

I hope your right Dan. It almost seems we have changed our formation because we have been unable to find decent fullbacks. Agree with Peter, based on current form and fitness there is no way JJ is good enough to play the Ryman Premier. The old JJ is good enough to play as higher level as he wishes.



__________________
Lenny The Lion
Guru
Status: Offline
Posts: 1735
Date:
RE: Not so good news from the Observer (except for Sam Cruttwell)
Permalink  
 
I really can't see the point in JJ going seeing as he returns to America next month. Terry made a valid point in him trying to establish himself etc and then having to return. It just doesn't make sense to me.

__________________
johnw
Guru
Status: Offline
Posts: 1885
Date:
RE: Not so good news from the Observer (except for Sam Cruttwell)
Permalink  
 

I wonder what the chances are if any of getting Josh Hare back? Last time I looked he was still languishing amongst the reserve and youth players at Gillingham. He looked a proper defender whilst he was with us. 



__________________
Lenny The Lion
Guru
Status: Offline
Posts: 1735
Date:
RE: Not so good news from the Observer (except for Sam Cruttwell)
Permalink  
 
He's made the bench a few times for the first team John, I can't see him coming back now.

__________________
ChrisB
Guru
Status: Offline
Posts: 1437
Date:
RE: Not so good news from the Observer (except for Sam Cruttwell)
Permalink  
 
My reference to cost of things, was to explain why we are a laughing stock, have you not heard at other grounds "at least we don't pay your prices" Pat its easy to find fault in my posts, but you can't answer my point asking for positives

__________________
Overthehill
Member
Status: Offline
Posts: 22
Date:
RE: Not so good news from the Observer (except for Sam Cruttwell)
Permalink  
 
Good luck to Sam. It's a great opportunity for him. if nothing else, he'll see what a real football club looks like and what professionalism means.

Picture this.....an unnamed East Sussex football club's Board Meeting in 6 months' time...."The boy...er, can't remember his name now... has done good at Hull....let's demand £1.2m compensation and first team friendlies for the next 20 years....that'll keep us going.....and oh yea....let's sack the Manager..he's been here far too long and is trying to manage the team his way...who does he think he is.........yea, I know we just scrapped the U-21s...no point in 'aving them..... "

There we are, transported into a world of fantasy football...........

__________________
Hamilton
Senior Member
Status: Offline
Posts: 113
Date:
RE: Not so good news from the Observer (except for Sam Cruttwell)
Permalink  
 

Unfortunately no compensation will be due for Sam. The latest rules governing Professional Football Academies means that any gain for Hastings would be at Hull's discretion and is purely good will. It may have been different if he was a contracted player but I'm assuming he is non-contract.

__________________
Pat
Guru
Status: Offline
Posts: 513
Date:
RE: Not so good news from the Observer (except for Sam Cruttwell)
Permalink  
 
What a load of tripe over the hill. Most ridiculous post I have read. Crutwell is not on a contract for starters .

__________________

Gooaaaalllllllll

 
Lenny The Lion
Guru
Status: Offline
Posts: 1735
Date:
RE: Not so good news from the Observer (except for Sam Cruttwell)
Permalink  
 
League rules state that any player in full time education can not be on a contract.

__________________
Sean Adams
Senior Member
Status: Offline
Posts: 195
Date:
RE: Not so good news from the Observer (except for Sam Cruttwell)
Permalink  
 

To be fair though Pat, the poster does admit in the final sentence that the words are pure fantasy, so probably best to leave them to their alternative reality.

I am rather more concerned to learn from Chris that the Club is a laughing stock, and have to ask with whom? This is certainly not the perception that I have gleaned in my dealings with opposing supporters and officials, members of the press, and other independent visitors to the Pilot Field and other grounds this season. Upon whose views is your assertion based please Chris?

As for positives, I suppose that being fourth in the table, with games in hand that could take us third, and therefore being in with a perfectly decent shot at promotion, despite today's result, could count as one or two. The Club is solvent, and has remained so for several years, and now has money in the bank thanks to last year's unforgettable FA Cup run. Then there is the ground, and the pitch, which are the envy of so many, the small army of volunteers that keep things gong behind the scenes, the fact that one of our talented young players has been invited to a trial by Hull City....

It is such a shame to allow personal differences with an individual to become predominant in shaping a view on the bigger picture.



__________________
Pat
Guru
Status: Offline
Posts: 513
Date:
RE: Not so good news from the Observer (except for Sam Cruttwell)
Permalink  
 
Brilliant post Sean. Couldn't have put it better myself.

__________________

Gooaaaalllllllll

 
ChrisB
Guru
Status: Offline
Posts: 1437
Date:
RE: Not so good news from the Observer (except for Sam Cruttwell)
Permalink  
 
Sean. Playing in a league at least 1 level below where we should and being only 4th is hardly a positive. And with that is the ground shouldn't be compared to ryman south but conference south where I believe we should be. Agree about finance. The laughing stock refers to other clubs we have played and a number of clubs fans complain about our prices. The other joke aimed at us is to do with our managerial turnover.
Going back to 4th being a positive how come if its a positive you sack a manager When you are 4th.

__________________
Peter R
Senior Member
Status: Offline
Posts: 499
Date:
RE: Not so good news from the Observer (except for Sam Cruttwell)
Permalink  
 
yes good post sean and i think sometimes some people live always with glass half empty. i also saw on newspaper last week the club donated money as well as us to hospice which is very good. chris does have pont that we pay more to watch but i am happy to do that if it helps the club i love to suport and it was £10 to get in today at Tooting so we not only club charging that amount so maybe everyone laughing at tooting to.

__________________
Overthehill
Member
Status: Offline
Posts: 22
Date:
RE: Not so good news from the Observer (except for Sam Cruttwell)
Permalink  
 
Interesting reaction to my tongue-in-cheek post. Think I might have touched some sort of nerve. It seems that any type of posting that is even a tiny bit critical is shot down in flames by people who seem to think that being fourth in this dreadful league is glass half full. Come on...the ground is the envy of other teams..really? A crumbling stand that should really be condemned for starters? The only things to be envied are the magnificent playing surface (no wonder teams like coming to us) and the superb group of volunteers who keep the club running. Let's push for promotion...then what? We had continual struggles to stay in the Ryman Premier and it'll be the same again. Why are people not looking for change in the way the club is run? Why this continual acceptance of mediocrity and crass decision making? I went to my first game at the PF in 1968 and like everybody else, I've seen some good and bad times. The standard in this division is the worst I have ever seen. I want to see a decent team playing at a decent level, consistently well run and respected for its role in the community. There is no reason why this can't happen but it seems we are incapable of doing it. What are people scared of? Why are there so many blinkered sycophants who want to condemn any criticism of the way things are done? I just don't get it. Perhaps I am in fantasy land but all I want is for a club that I have supported all my life to have a bit of success, consistency, and a solid,well-planned future. To get local lads to play for us rather than play for money at other local clubs. To get us back on the non-League map.

__________________
Sean Adams
Senior Member
Status: Offline
Posts: 195
Date:
Not so good news from the Observer (except for Sam Cruttwell)
Permalink  
 

 

Chris, you can spend as long as you like putting negative spin on positive thoughts, the same as I can put positive spin on negative thoughts, but it will achieve nothing more than for both of us to bore everyone to tears.

I am intrigued by your perception that United "should be" a Conference South side though. Do you mind if I ask why?

That said, I remain much more concerned by your description of the Club as a laughing stock anyway, although you seem to suggest that this partly based upon complaints about our prices. It is not right that you should have to field complaints on behalf of the Club, so do please refer any concerned individuals to a Club Official in future.

The number of managers is what it is, to be fair, although I struggle to understand how that could make the Club a laughing stock. It might be a source of banter between rival sets of supporters, I suppose, but isn't that just part of the game?

When a football club sacks a manager, I suspect that there are wider considerations than purely its specific league placing at the time.

Edited after reading Overthehill's post.

I think it's fair to say that opinions on both sides of the supporter divide get shot down, not just the critical views.

We do of course all share the vision of United playing at a higher level, or we should do anyway, but how to best achieve that aim has always been the sticking point. What thoughts?

 



-- Edited by Sean Adams on Saturday 1st of March 2014 11:12:43 PM



-- Edited by Sean Adams on Saturday 1st of March 2014 11:13:19 PM

__________________
Overthehill
Member
Status: Offline
Posts: 22
Date:
RE: Not so good news from the Observer (except for Sam Cruttwell)
Permalink  
 
Interesting post, Sean. If a town the size of Hastings has a facility like an upgraded Pilot Field and a well-organised, thriving football club, then Conference South is decent enough. So why not? I'd also like you to consider the ratio of sackings - top 5 team managers to bottom 5 team managers, as I suspect such wider considerations are rare (everywhere else, that is..)

__________________
ChrisB
Guru
Status: Offline
Posts: 1437
Date:
RE: Not so good news from the Observer (except for Sam Cruttwell)
Permalink  
 
Conference South : size of catchment area, crowd potential, Ground, just look at our main rivals from days past Tonbridge, Dover, Crawley, where are they performing now way above us. Its only Ashford that aren't. Who would have thought 15 years ago that Peacehaven would be above us.
What level do you've think we should be at then?

__________________
Overthehill
Member
Status: Offline
Posts: 22
Date:
RE: Not so good news from the Observer (except for Sam Cruttwell)
Permalink  
 
Thoughts as follows:

There is no doubt in my mind that the top end of the club has to change. I know how hard it is, but ultimately, the direction of the club has to change and those in office have had a decent shot at it. Get people in at the top end who have new ideas - sacking managers every 2 minutes is not a good idea.

So get in a local bloke with some football knowledge and have a clean sweep. Put personal differences to one side. Unite the club with a strong leader and people prepared to innovate and challenge. Embark upon the biggest charm offensive the town has ever seen. Get out to schools, businesses, newspapers, radio, TV and present a solid, robust 5 year plan with short, medium and long term objectives. Involve the community, don't alienate anybody. Get the Observer to buy into the objectives. Charm the pants off the Council. Appoint a manager and stick with him. Tell him he's got a 2 year deal but he's got to understand the pressure to deliver specific objectives. Call it what you like - rebirth, new dawn. Appoint a communications man to be the voice of the club. Involve supporters - what do they want to see - pool ideas, rule nothing in or out (provided it's realistic). Focus on the first team, but have a Reserve side and an U18s - reserves play Saturday,18s on a Sunday. Get all the teams playing the same way. Make the prospect of playing for HUFC exciting again. Introduce a charter/code of conduct which applies to everybody at the club - this is why we do it, this is how we do it, this is what we do (in that order).

IT CAN BE DONE!

__________________
Pat
Guru
Status: Offline
Posts: 513
Date:
RE: Not so good news from the Observer (except for Sam Cruttwell)
Permalink  
 
Funny isnt it that whenever you have a positive view that you get called a sycophant or some other derogatory name for supporting your club and its management. I accept that there are those out there that have an opposing view to mine but i dont see the need for petty name calling if someone differs with me. You seem to think that its ok to put out your views as long as nobody disagrees - you cant have it both ways! Overthehill, you state that you get gunned down for posts but i think you'll find that this happens the other way round as well. Its what a good forum is all about - allowing differing views. And no, none of us accept fourth in this league I certainly dont, but I dont see the point in consistently rubbishing every detail that I can think of right down to the price of food, which seems to be the credo of some. My point since October was that we didnt strengthen the team early enough - especially the defence and sadly that has proved to be a big problem for us in the latter stages, so -

No, its not all perfect for sure, but we have a solvent club with ambition to go higher. A decent ground ( Yes the stand is old, but whose isnt? Folkestones has fallen over) with a lot of hard working volunteers, and as Sean pointed out - a real chance of play off place. We have a great playing surface and have a decent home record. I get as fed up and frustrated as anyone else when I see performances like that in the second half this afternoon and I'm not afraid to voice that disappointment at all. That said, I am not going to view the glass as half empty and never will.

__________________

Gooaaaalllllllll

 
Overthehill
Member
Status: Offline
Posts: 22
Date:
RE: Not so good news from the Observer (except for Sam Cruttwell)
Permalink  
 
Pat - is it not rather silly to suggest that I don't like my views being challenged? Of course I expect them to be, like everybody else. I just do not share some people's faith in how the club is run and I am entitled to that opinion. If you feel differently, I respect that opinion. I also feel that there is some sort of blocker to change and that is why I get frustrated. I also don't believe in petty name-calling. If there is no sycophantic element, then fantastic, 'cos that means everybody involved is having open and honest debates about the clubs present and future position. That can only be healthy. As to the club's ambitions, what are they?

__________________
ChrisB
Guru
Status: Offline
Posts: 1437
Date:
RE: Not so good news from the Observer (except for Sam Cruttwell)
Permalink  
 
Overthehill your posts are valid and I know a fair few including myself that agree with the majority of what you say. DW has had his chance to improve and take us forward, and failed its time now for someone else to have a go.

__________________
timbjones
Guru
Status: Offline
Posts: 836
Date:
RE: Not so good news from the Observer (except for Sam Cruttwell)
Permalink  
 
What is frustrating for supporters is seeing Hastings struggling in a low level of non-league football when sides like Bognor, Eastbourne and Lewes are playing and progressing at a higher level. We don't, of course, have a right to play at a higher standard but I think it is a reasonable expectation that Hastings should have a Conference South team. With our present ownership set up what, realistically, can Hastings achieve? If we manage to get promoted I think we all know what will follow. A few seasons trying to stave off relegation.

__________________
hammerfan
Senior Member
Status: Offline
Posts: 177
Date:
RE: Not so good news from the Observer (except for Sam Cruttwell)
Permalink  
 
This is all well and good but : -

1) DW has got to show a willingness to sell at a sensibly price.
2) There needs to be someone willing to pay DW's price and be able to invest and hang around long enough to make a difference.
3) Any new purchaser has to be able to get a new lease from Hastings Borough Council, the present one includes the owner being liable for the upkeep of the main stand (a quote was obtained by the previous owners to replace the main supports some years ago in the sum of £80k - guess a lot more now !)

Can't see any of this taking place in the imminent future or present economic climate. !!!!!!

__________________
MrLiamWillis
Admin
Status: Offline
Posts: 1779
Date:
Not so good news from the Observer (except for Sam Cruttwell)
Permalink  
 

A sensible price would still involve a very significant investment and also the funds to invest afterwards as Hammerfan says. As far as I am aware there is no individual currently around the club or within its fans who is capable of fulfilling the above criteria and keeping the club afloat better than the current regime?

Also the previous Mark Gardener situation showed that things can defiantly be worse than they are now under even a very wealthy owner.

Is is there really a realistic alternative elsewhere or is everything being discussed just hypothetical? 

Also would another regime defiantly had reduced the admission fee in the face of the council adding another £4k to our rates? I would have liked to have seen it dropped to £9 but do understand why they felt they couldn't. It probably would have involved adding around 20% to our crowds to beak even compared to £10 entry.

Agree the food is pricier than other clubs but almost certainly better than almost all. ( didn't go to Chipstead so can't compare that one ) maybe you need to speak to Kev the SC chairman regarding this firstly and through him see if they will buy cheaper ingredients and sell cheaper food.



__________________
Lenny The Lion
Guru
Status: Offline
Posts: 1735
Date:
Not so good news from the Observer (except for Sam Cruttwell)
Permalink  
 

I think people are overlooking the main thing here, what if DW doesn't want to sell and why should he? He owns the club and you cannot force someone to sell something that they don't want to?
We all want to play at the highest level possible and that includes the board. It makes me chuckle that people who come along to help out for one reason or another fail to realise how much money and time is needed in the upkeep of the ground. There is ALWAYS something that needs doing or something that needs to be repaired and this all comes at a huge cost yet the club is still solvent.
I saw somebodies post re getting the council onside, the plain truth is they just can't be bothered and have no interest in the town having a senior football club. We are all aware of the plan that was put together to build a new stadium and how much that cost only for the council to blank it. Admitedly it wasn't the best timing regards the credit crunch etc but even last year when the club was the talk of the nations media they never sent a single message of good luck or well done! Seems to me they'd rather waste money and. have an art gallery that attracts a handful of people compared to a lot more that would benefit from a Stadium and facilities for the community. I thought yesterday how such a facility that Tooting have could improve the area, ok it's not looked after but I understand the owner never visits the place, that wouldn't happen in Hastings. 
The ground has recently been inspected by The FA for ground grading and with just a handful of minor jobs to do, has (when The FA sign it off) achieved a Conferance South grading but again that has come with a financial cost. I know clubs such as Eastbourne, Lewes and Tonbridge have all moved up the leagues but at what cost? At least two of those have had money issues in recent years. What would people prefer a club in debt and an uncertain future or a club which many have said they have supported for years still playing owing nothing at a lower level?

The club are investing in the future, the chairman said in a recent programme that the current manager is keen to keep the u21 squad and there is plans to improve the U18 squad with investment too. It's the first year of The Ryman U21 league, I agree there is teething problems with it, I too would prefer Saturday fixtures maybe it's something that may change next season? I don't know. Somebody suggested playing the U18's on a Sunday, the highest league the U18's can play on a Sunday is the county league and in all fairness the Sussex county league is not competitive enough and the kent league tend to be less than favourable towards a side from Sussex as was the case a number of times last season when the development centres u16 squad found out. So really The Ryman youth league is the probably the best for develpoment.
As Dan and Hammer have eluded to, If DW did decide to sell then I can assure you whoever bought the club would find it a very expensive investment.



__________________
MrLiamWillis
Admin
Status: Offline
Posts: 1779
Date:
Not so good news from the Observer (except for Sam Cruttwell)
Permalink  
 

Better to be nicely solvent than relying on a just giving page like this club who are in a very similar position to us (Bottom of the  Southern League Prem )  in the fact they do not own their ground except they are fan owned....

image.jpg



Attachments
__________________
timbjones
Guru
Status: Offline
Posts: 836
Date:
RE: Not so good news from the Observer (except for Sam Cruttwell)
Permalink  
 
I am very pleased the club is solvent and hopefully is being run in a prudent manner. Does David Walters have to sell his ownership of the club to get other people involved in investing in the club? All this is hypothetical but what if David Walters invited other people to be part owners and invest in the club. Would this be a possible way forward?
These people may not exist but it might be worth investigating. I don't think we will be any other than a lower ranking Ryman Premier side at best if we stay as we are. That,of course, maybe our true level. Also, Jeremy Birch and Peter Pragnell are fairly regular supporters at our home games so at least the council does show some interest.

__________________
ChrisB
Guru
Status: Offline
Posts: 1437
Date:
RE: Not so good news from the Observer (except for Sam Cruttwell)
Permalink  
 
Bashley is a village in the new forest not a town with 90,000 people, if you have been there you will appreciate why they struggle. Dan unless you know what DW wants for the club how do you know if anyone can afford it. Lenny you are totally correct he does not have to sell, its probably just hope from a lot of us that he does.
I appreciate it costs to run a club but how do you expect us to know how much as we are not party to these figures. Honestly in 12 months time I believe we will be in the same situation, had another 2 managers and about 40 players.

__________________
MrLiamWillis
Admin
Status: Offline
Posts: 1779
Date:
Not so good news from the Observer (except for Sam Cruttwell)
Permalink  
 

Chris I haven't got a clue what he would want but to get the market value just have a look online at the published accounts, DWs shares of that etc and that what will give you an idea of what would be the likely minimum. Significant money.

Fair point about the size of Bashley, I didn't know anything about them but just shows that over stretching budgets or not having sufficient ongoing asserts can lead to disaster. Would rather have a solvent club than a dissolved club.



__________________
Lenny The Lion
Guru
Status: Offline
Posts: 1735
Date:
RE: Not so good news from the Observer (except for Sam Cruttwell)
Permalink  
 
Tim, both those councillors visits to The Pilot Field are far and few between. The last time I saw Pragnell at the club was last season looking for complimentary tickets for the Harrogate game, I have seen Jeremy Birch at a game at the start of the season but not since then. So all in all not that much of an interest is it?

__________________
dave a
Veteran Member
Status: Offline
Posts: 82
Date:
RE: Not so good news from the Observer (except for Sam Cruttwell)
Permalink  
 
saw Jeremy birch at the Guernsey game lenny, but would like to say we are a big town and why should,nt we expect to be in a much higher lg,iv'e said many times don't break the bank and yes stay solvent but we do have the money to buy quality,if we were to get promotion we would have to buy and each season after that if we wanted to move on and not to be happy to stay at this lowly level .just get the feeling were scared to let money go.

__________________
daveandrews
Peter R
Senior Member
Status: Offline
Posts: 499
Date:
RE: Not so good news from the Observer (except for Sam Cruttwell)
Permalink  
 
i seen birch and pragnall a few times this season, pragnall was there 2 weeks ago, i think they both come a bit but there support is as supporter not from council and i always think they dont see the football club as that important. chrisb say we are laughing stock but only thing i seen from forums horsham and worthing and from ground at worthing is our supporters are arrogant and billy big bollocks! overthehill i dont think you can have seen many under 18 game in area. i have watched our under 18 in ryman yth league on thursday and standard is very good. i have watched sussex county yth league on a sunday at little common and standard is very poor. i think i remember seeing our under 18 side on sunday when razor was manager and we used to win 8, 9 and 10 nil so say we should play on sunday is stupid. and there is a 3g in hastings now at the academy. i think tim has a point with Walters asking for investor but with ground being very old i cant see it being attractive. compare to eastbourne can not see how we can make extra money but eastbourne have big social place and that bowls thing. tonbridge had money but think it gone now and they look like relegation this year. i think club should look at other way to bring money in but with our old and limited ground not sure how that can be done.
i think we need a manager that needs to be in job long time and develop through under 18 and 21. i like terry white his interviews on observer page are honest but it is a worry that we have manager lots of coaches but no one to motivate player. he need to be strong and if player not up for fight then best they walk.

__________________
Lenny The Lion
Guru
Status: Offline
Posts: 1735
Date:
RE: Not so good news from the Observer (except for Sam Cruttwell)
Permalink  
 
I never saw him Dave but I accept I have seen him there more than Pragnell. Just to point out if I may? although it may sound a bit nit picking we don't buy players in this league, unless a player is under contract and those are few and far between. We certainly would have to pay more money re players wages and I agree that we would obviously have to get better players in as and when we were promoted and move up the league but as I've pointed out earlier that would be another expense and of course would need more income.

__________________
Lenny The Lion
Guru
Status: Offline
Posts: 1735
Date:
RE: Not so good news from the Observer (except for Sam Cruttwell)
Permalink  
 
Peter I apologise, I stand corrected I've honestly not seen Pragnell since the live game with Harrogate. I also agree though that they are probably supporters rather than interested in a more official role which is even more embarrassing as you'd think they'd want the club to progress. Frankly its strange.

__________________
Overthehill
Member
Status: Offline
Posts: 22
Date:
RE: Not so good news from the Observer (except for Sam Cruttwell)
Permalink  
 
Thanks, Peter R for labelling a reasonable suggestion as "stupid". I watch more matches than you think, I am suitably qualified, so don't make assumptions. I can see why some other clubs' supporters give us unpleasant labels. It's a bit hypocritical to dismiss all Sussex County Leagues as being rubbish and beneath us - we need to remember where we are, which is in a poor division made up of ex-County League teams, most of whom have very little chance of progressing. Let's face it, Ryman Premier would be a big step up, and Conference South is a million miles away. We need to forget this BillyBigTime stuff - a bit of humility and a quiet determination to move forward in the right way is required. That's the only way to gain support.

__________________
MrLiamWillis
Admin
Status: Offline
Posts: 1779
Date:
RE: Not so good news from the Observer (except for Sam Cruttwell)
Permalink  
 
Certainly agree with that part Overthehill. Most of us including myself have at times referred to the league as a 'County League', 'terrible league' etc. Think we all need to accept that we are were we are due to our performances alone and that nothing other than hard work will get us out now. I can certainly see why some fans and teams really see us as a scalp in the same way that that Luton have had a lot of hate over the past few seasons in the Con Prem due to them still considering themselves a Championship or League 1 quality side.

Not sure if our inability to lead the table is due to our weakness or the other contenders strength however, Peacehaven are clearly doing a 'Whitehawk' with a budget that must far exceed their natural income and is a dangerous game to play as their fan base will never provide the income to be sustainable. Guernsey have Ross Allen and whilst they have a solid team are as much a one man team as I have ever seen. They have been fortunate that he has escaped injury. Leatherhead have done very well however especially with the flooding and there is no negatives on regard to them.

We have had a good first XI or so players generally but our main weakness IMO is our small squad and comparative inability to score enough goals.



__________________
Overthehill
Member
Status: Offline
Posts: 22
Date:
RE: Not so good news from the Observer (except for Sam Cruttwell)
Permalink  
 
Dan, think you're right. I don't really see how the Peacehaven/Whitehawk models are sustainable. Mind you, I don't see the point of having loads of money in the bank and a poorish team on the pitch. At least Guernsey appear to be well supported. Leatherhead have always been a decent outfit and it's not a place to go and win every time. I also probably think we underestimated where we are - we probably started off amongst the favourites to go straight back up, but we've not been good enough, often enough, to do that. Another year in this division is an unhappy prospect, but we've got to hope we can put some sort of run together and perform miracles in the play offs. Lots of hard work and focus, methinks.........

__________________
Pat
Guru
Status: Offline
Posts: 513
Date:
RE: Not so good news from the Observer (except for Sam Cruttwell)
Permalink  
 
I read OvertheHills suggested way forward with interest as also the last few posts.There seems to be the phrase “laughing stock”, but it is only used by two people. I also talk to a lot of away supporters and keep in touch with some by email. From my conversations “laughing stock” couldn’t be further from the truth. There is envy of our attendances and also our ground, especially the pitch. There is always talk about last years exploits in the FA Cup – and rightly so. I don’t know who you are talking to but they are not the same people as I do – perhaps I will meet one at some point. As Peter says – there are some rivalries from other clubs supporters but that is part and parcel of football. There seems to have been all manner of comment aboutt our standing in the leagues – how many managers and state of the ground etc, but I honestly believe that we are in a great financial position which is to be absolutely applauded, and whilst the playing side needs mmore work, Terry needs the time to be doing it. Lots of clubs at our level change managers – some twice a season too, but they are not laughing stocks at all. Its just what happens at this level. Supporters cry for manager after manager to be sacked and yet when the chairman acts – its him that’s got the bad judgement and shouldn’t have done the deed.. I don’t think anyone would have disputed his appointment of John Maggs, and I didn’t speak to anyone who disagreed with the departure. It was regrettable but it happens. Terry needs to be given time, but already theres rumblings about his capability which is unfair given the mess he inherited.
I disagree with you Overthehill on changing the board and management. This chairman – in my opinion has done well for this club. On the pitch we have seen a promotion and a relegation, disappointing as that was. We have also seen a cup run that we may never again experience.But above all that, the club is financially stable, and did not go into debt even during the credit crunch when others went to the wall. Supporters of Hinckley etc would love to be us right now, for that I’m certain. But yes, we do need to look ahead and not accept the current position, and I like what you say Overthehill about going out on the charm offensive. We used to spend many Saturday mornings down the town with Leonard giving away the odd free ticket and doing photos etc.I spent time in Arrow FM’s offices either dressed as a seagull or in mufti to spread the word. Leonard also did the taxi run. We got tired of doing it as we were the only few interested enough to do it. We used to ask for help but it was ( and still is) hard to engage volunteers even for a few hours. I’m sure that your plans don’t involve paying people to do all this work – so it is a reliance on volunteers. Again – a communications manager? We have a perfectly good one who is also voluntary. I don’t know of many non league clubs of our level with a full time press officer, that’s more for the professional clubs I would imagine. But I do take your point about getting out and about, and if you have any spare time to help us with that, in all sincerity I would be grateful.
Im not up on the U 21’s or U 18’s as much as Peter but from what I did see over the last few seasons, I think hes right about the standard on a Sunday.

I think for the playing budget we have that better players could have been brought in earlier in the season which is why we struggle now. My opinion though.

__________________

Gooaaaalllllllll

 
Overthehill
Member
Status: Offline
Posts: 22
Date:
RE: Not so good news from the Observer (except for Sam Cruttwell)
Permalink  
 
Great post, Pat.

__________________
BertNEC
Guru
Status: Offline
Posts: 1899
Date:
RE: Not so good news from the Observer (except for Sam Cruttwell)
Permalink  
 
Overthehill wrote:

Great post, Pat.

 I agree 100 % !

And according to volunteers ; i hope the suggestion Pat makes will make new members !



__________________
A foreign supporter !
ChrisB
Guru
Status: Offline
Posts: 1437
Date:
RE: Not so good news from the Observer (except for Sam Cruttwell)
Permalink  
 
Pat. Think you need to ask the question why so few volunteer? There are a few of us that may volunteer but not under the current regime


__________________
Pat
Guru
Status: Offline
Posts: 513
Date:
RE: Not so good news from the Observer (except for Sam Cruttwell)
Permalink  
 
Im not saying that we get so few volunteers, as each season we do get some new ones, but the pool of time that we have collectively is not always near what needs to be done. I wondered what you would say about that Chris and what spin youd add- -. In fact, if what you say is true - how childish for someone to refuse to help because they have a problem with an individual ( I presume the chairman?) . If that is so Chris – what has he done to you personally that makes you take that action? I know others reasons and everyone has a right to do as they see fit , - and I acknowledge that, but just curious what he has done to you as most of your posts now seem to implicate your extreme dislike for him. If I am wrong and it is not the chairman – please accept my apologies for reading into things.
Lots of football clubs manage to operate with voluntary help whether supporters like the board or not – but in regards to volunteers – of course we would love more but we get by !


__________________

Gooaaaalllllllll

 
Peter R
Senior Member
Status: Offline
Posts: 499
Date:
RE: Not so good news from the Observer (except for Sam Cruttwell)
Permalink  
 
overthehill you have not seen under 18 game on sunday. if you had then you would not suggest we play under 18 on sunday. ryman youth league much better and more like men football, sunday county leagu more like boy football. thats why i said your suggestions was stupid. if you watch lot of games then not relevent to what you suggested. i would volunteer pat but with family, work just never had time i think that is same for lots of people with credit crunch but maybe it getting better now so more people might be able to help

__________________
Lenny The Lion
Guru
Status: Offline
Posts: 1735
Date:
RE: Not so good news from the Observer (except for Sam Cruttwell)
Permalink  
 
From what I understand we have more volunteers now then we've ever had? I estimate that there is approximately 20 at the club and may be a few more. The problem is they are exactly that volunteers and all have other priorities such as work and family commitments and to get them to adjust or fit extra time in for club activities outside normal matchday hours is difficult.

__________________
ChrisB
Guru
Status: Offline
Posts: 1437
Date:
RE: Not so good news from the Observer (except for Sam Cruttwell)
Permalink  
 
Pat will pm you later, to explain why as I would need to give names as to why I won't volunteer at present.

__________________
Pat
Guru
Status: Offline
Posts: 513
Date:
RE: Not so good news from the Observer (except for Sam Cruttwell)
Permalink  
 
Understand Chris and will read your PM but my question was - what has he done to you personally?
. Barrie is right also - ive painted a worse picture than i intended. What i meant was that we dont have enough volunteer hours for all the work that is needed. Hope that makes more sense than my original post

__________________

Gooaaaalllllllll

 
Lenny The Lion
Guru
Status: Offline
Posts: 1735
Date:
RE: Not so good news from the Observer (except for Sam Cruttwell)
Permalink  
 
Sussex county youth football is a joke, it's not competitive and will have little if any use in the development of players. the Ryman youth league is possibly the highest league outside the Conference youth set up than the U18 squad can play at. It's a good standard. I recall the first season we entered our U18 squad in that league and witnessed them beating Sidley, Bexhill and Hollington. If you played them in the county league I can assure you they would not achieve that. Take a look at the U18 Sussex cup and look to see how many sides in recent years have come from the county league and how many have come from Ryman youth sides, its a non contest.

__________________
Overthehill
Member
Status: Offline
Posts: 22
Date:
Not so good news from the Observer (except for Sam Cruttwell)
Permalink  
 

Peter R - interesting reply. Let me put a scenario to you. We have an U-18 team made up of the best local 16 and 17 year olds (those not quite ready for Reserve team football). We play on a Sunday without huge amounts of travelling. We play more local teams every week. We beat one local team 8-0. Say they have a decent player who doesn't like getting stuffed every week and looks at the prospects he might have - might such lads then say "I'd rather play for Hastings United"? There's nothing wrong with winning every week - it boosts confidence at that age and encourages self expression. A few years ago we'd have looked at Ryman South and said "that's a crap League, we'd win 10-0 every week". Not the case, is it? Ah well, probably another stupid and irrelevant suggestion.......

 

I see Lenny's point and agree that Sussex U-18s isn't great. What I'm suggesting is a stepping stone for 16  and 17 years olds to get into Reserve team football as soon as they are able. At 16/17 they're probably playing above their age group in the 18s and I don't see that they need to be playing hugely competitive games - it's more about their development and playing in some far from glamorous and testing environments, without lots of travelling. I also think they should have interaction with the Reserves and first team, which is not always easy if  they play midweek all the time.     



-- Edited by Overthehill on Monday 3rd of March 2014 02:24:01 PM

__________________
Peter R
Senior Member
Status: Offline
Posts: 499
Date:
RE: Not so good news from the Observer (except for Sam Cruttwell)
Permalink  
 
overthehill i am glad you answered your question to save me the trouble

__________________
ChrisB
Guru
Status: Offline
Posts: 1437
Date:
RE: Not so good news from the Observer (except for Sam Cruttwell)
Permalink  
 
Pat. Personally to me nothing. But neither has Ed Milliband and I wouldn't volunteer to help him either


__________________
Overthehill
Member
Status: Offline
Posts: 22
Date:
RE: Not so good news from the Observer (except for Sam Cruttwell)
Permalink  
 
Cheers, PeterR. Glad to help. I'm off to see my psychiatrist.........

__________________
Lenny The Lion
Guru
Status: Offline
Posts: 1735
Date:
RE: Not so good news from the Observer (except for Sam Cruttwell)
Permalink  
 
Overthehill involving younger lads in with the first team is something the chairman is keen on and something Terry is doing. just look at Sam Cruttwell, Maggs didn't think he was good enough and it cam close to him leaving, Terry has given him an opportunity and he's taken it and now a premiership club is knocking on the door offering him a trial. Granted it may well be down to Dean White buthe has a reputation to look after and wouldn't suggest a player if he felt he wasn't capable.
Make no mistake development of players from U18s upwards is high on the agenda with the club. I won't lie,I believe it hasn't always been that way but in my eyes its changed and certainly the board are keen to establish a solid youth and U21 section, it's the clubs future and hopefully this will be proven in the upcoming months.

__________________
Overthehill
Member
Status: Offline
Posts: 22
Date:
RE: Not so good news from the Observer (except for Sam Cruttwell)
Permalink  
 
Thanks, Lenny. Sensible approach. Great to hear.

__________________
 
Page 1 of 1  sorted by
Quick Reply

Please log in to post quick replies.
 


Create your own FREE Forum
Report Abuse 		Powered by ActiveBoard