With just 57 days to go to the start of the new season is it too early too start panicking about our first team squad? Lets look at the facts after reading today's observer. We have lost Zac, Jack, Bradley, Dee and Elliott. We have no news on Bailo, who seems to be a part time player anyway due to work commitments. Many think that Jamie will leave and play more local to where he lives or perhaps even join his good mate Matt Whitehead at Lewes? who knows. Are Jono Richardson and Lee Carey good enough to push towards a promotion place next season? Many will say no. We have Razor recovering from knee surgery and starting a 4 game ban at the beginning of the season. We have Danny Ellis with a 3 game ban and Vickers with a 7 game ban. So if my calculations are right, with 57 days to go, we have a team for the opening game of the season of Pelling, Judge, Adams and Maclean! Am i wrong to be panicking in the middle of June?
Have Bradley, Dee and Elliot definatly gone mate? not heard that they've signed for anyone?
Difficult with Bailo as would definatly keep him if he was available every game.
Think Carey and Richardson ( As a CB ) would be solid in the Ryman South if not exceptional. Would keep them both.
It is easy to get panicked and i have too but no playesr can officialy be registed until July 1st anyway so yes probably is too early to panic thankfully, but that wont stop us anyway :)
Observer claims that Dee and Elliott are to leave and they are making plans without Bradley as they are unsure on his future, although would have been surprised if he stayed even if we stayed up.
It just worries me that the message coming from the club is that they are looking to build a team around local talent. Does anyone really believe there is enough local talent to send us straight back up? Most of these players have done a great job down at Rye but they couldn't win them the county league so what makes us think they will win us the Ryman? I hope I'm proved wrong.
A team of just local players has not worked in the past and is unlikely to now. As bad as Ryman South is you need a decent squad (not just 11) to get out of it. With reasonably local sides such as Hythe and Folkestone reported to be paying more than we are it's not looking great, is it.
Wasn't the side that got us promoted through the play offs a side a majority of local players? So I think your comment re never worked isn't quite true.
Maybe a team of the towns local talent would be good enough for a tilt at Ryman South. Unfortunately it seems that we are cobbling a squad together consisting of 2nd/3rd tier of the towns talent. It's all been a bit underwhelming so far with too many good players leaving and being replaced with County league. The excitement of us using the FA Cup money as a war chest to assemble a side capable of winning that league is gurgling down the plug hole...
agree although it may be to early to panic it does seem we are yet again seeming to lag behind in getting experience in, as ive always said it would be stupid to blow the fa cup money plus the extra bonus from the fa but we wll have to spend don't think a team of mainly local players will be strong enough.and are rye and Bexhill areas we can only look at,without spending will we be a stable club with no debts but going nowhere,as ive said don't overspend cos when the moneys gone so will the players finding that balance is the hard bit,imo a team of local players will take more than one season for promotion I would gladly take the flak to be told at the end of the season WHATdid you say dave.
I've said it many times......our only ambition is to remain in the black. A mid table position in Ryman South is about as good as we can hope for. Can anyone give me a bit more hope than that from what has developed close season so far ? I've bought a season ticket for more seasons than I can remember.....And I guess I will again but it will be more through loyalty to the club than a real expectation of real promotion chasing excitement. As I say....someone convince me that my pessimism is misplaced.
This is all pointless speculation at the moment as all you can do is talk to prospective players until 1st July, so even if someone says they are signing for us, until they do - they could still get a better offer and go elsewhere.
Very few players who do not live locally are going to positively commit to traveling to Hastings every week until they have spoken with all their local sides and considered all other options and most clubs will want to see players at pre-season training before making offers.
Also, for instance a player who lives any further than 30/40 miles away will want traveling expenses of at least £30/40/50 a week to come to Hastings on average 3 times a week. You have to also think that they will have travel time of say an hour plus each way, and as all players at our level have full time jobs - can they get time off or comit to that for a season ? If we signed 5 players that could end up costing us up to £1000 a month just in traveling expenses. Is this sustainable ?
This time last year the only new signing that was confirmed was Dee.
The time to worry is going to be middle-late July if the Club has not made announcements of signings.
Jamie Crellin tweeting that he has no idea where he will be next season. Surely we would have sat him down and thrashed out an offer for the new season as we did with Ben and Danny.. wouldn't we? Runner up in supporters player of the season so clearly a very popular player with the fans.
Im sure that he ( like JD ) is not too short of offers and could easily go to 3 or 4 clubs hopefully still including us. Just hope that we get a welcome surprise soon in terms of a good level new signing or two in the nearish future so that we can all start to get behind the new look team as we did with the guys who played last year, wish them all the best wherever they end up though!
Was disappointed to see in the paper as JohnW pinted out that Elliott looks likely to leave, one of the finds of last year for me, very consistent and a crowd favourite although we could never get a decent song for him!
Jamie Crellin has to be snapped up one of the only players to get stuck in last year and constantly driving everyone till the end quality leader in my eyes come a management lets get him signed!!!!!
you keep on about not being able to sign till july1st but players are commiting ,according to your earlier post it sounded like players will come here as a last resort so do we sit back and wait and hope .
Dave - As a supporter all we can do is "Sit back and wait and hope"
Some people on here seem to think that Messrs Ray and Co have sat on their butts since the season ended and have not spoken to anyone yet - I bet if you ask Sean he has spoken with about 100. A recent Observer mentioned six players still in talks. The other point that appears to have been forgotten is that we were relegated and how many players from higher leagues than Ryman South are we going to attract !
There is no point in the club coming out and saying we are talking to such and such and getting supporters hopes up if nothing is guaranteed. In fact most players talking to any club would not want it made public anyway.
Really can't understand all the fuss over Jamie Crellin. I remember him getting the equaliser at Harrogate and appearing on ESPN. Other than that I can't remember him scoring a goal, making a goal or actually having too much influence on any game in any way. Regularly he was part of a midfield that was getting overrun and outplayed. Personally I thought he was one of the weakest links in a not particularly good side and I won't shed too many tears if someone else snaps him up. Certainly not Ryman premier standard and we won't be bouncing back if this is the level we are settling for. A good leader ? Dunno! Rather have someone who can play a bit !
I cannot disagree with Mick's general point that last season's midfield was frequently overun and outplayed. I thought though that that was more the result of tactical uncertainty in the team as a whole, rather than shortcomings of ability by individuals such as Jamie.
The last thing I want rammed down my throat is Gary Wilson's rebuilding at Lewes. I'll be surprised if they don't finish higher in their league than we do in ours.
-- Edited by Mick on Wednesday 19th of June 2013 05:06:31 PM
Ryman League news.... Gary Wilson continues with his rebuilding at Lewes by completing the signing of 4 more players including Ben Austin from Eastbourne and Fraser Logan, captain of Crawley Down.???????? is it July 1st already?
Lewes - Signings the Crabb brothers - one of whom was with Lewes last season, Ben Austen & the other Crabb brother both played under Garry at Eastbourne Boro & Danny Bloor at Eastbourne Town and Fraser Logan was really a total flop when playing for us.
Talking of Lewes Gary Wilson has just signed a County League player and someone from the Eastbourne Town and have also stated a 'local' preference, doesnt seem to be any revolt on their forum just yet though! lol
Can the 1st July hurry up please all this waiting around for news is doing my head in! :)
Good to see Tim Olorunda return to the Pilot Field. We lacked any strength and drive in the center of the park last season and Tim is just what we require. He is only 28 so should be coming in to his prime. Just a shame his brother has not come with him.
I'm also glad to see that Tim will be returing. Too much has perhaps happened to allow Ade to come back at this point (and he may by now be comitted elsewhere); but if a reconciliation were possible, I would welcome it. I'm also glad to read that Jono Richardson will be staying. I know there have been those on this forum who question his level of skill; but I think that does not give him sufficient credit for the great improvement he made in the second half of last season.
I believe Ade is still in talks with Maidstone for next season.
With regards to Jono, last season he was continually played out of position. He is not a left back and his distribution is very poor. He has to play in the center, where he did very well, but once Sean is back from suspension I assume he will slot in along side Judge and Jono will once again revert to left back, which I think will be a mistake.
We had the same thing with Josh J a few seasons back. When he played out of position I didn't think he was good enough to be in the side, however when he moved to the center he was a completely different player.
Jono had a very good game at left back at Hitchin in the Fa cup but then so did everyone else. I do feel he's a better centre half hopefully he will show some improvement and be given a more " permanent" position in the squad.
The re-signing of Tim is a very welcome boost to us, IMO. He was very good before he left us and I think having him back in the side will give everyone a boost and I feel that he will contribute well to the midfield, providing a dangerous and attacking role. Usually the two Olorunda's go together, but I can't see it happening this time, even though we did see in Ade's interview with the paper when he said "I'd love to play for them (Hastings) again, but if things would change" - or he may even be committed elsewhere anyway.
I also strongly agree with Johnw regarding Jono Richardson. He's most definitely a player that needs to be played in the centre and is sort of a waste at left back. When we had Jimmy Elford at left back a few years ago, he was wasted when he was played in the centre of the defense - it didn't happen very often with him but when it did it didn't work as well as it did when he was playing at left back. Jono needs to be played in the middle, but with Sean Ray and Ben Judge in there I think that it will be hard for him to get back into the centre of the defense unless there is an unexpected formation change going in to next season.
I'm looking forward to see if we sign anymore people as I think that this season could be a very interesting one, and perhaps Ade may bite the bullet and potentially return to the PF - that'd be a talking point!!
I wish Ade well at Lewes. I just hope we can get for us someone of a similar playing style for the season ahead. I welcome Bailo's continuance with us and I rate Sam Adams; but I don't think they will on their own score the goals we have been missing since Ade's departure. I think Sam plays best behind a central striker and Bailo plays best wider. I just hope that we do manage to secure the services of a good, strong, conventional, 'old fashioned' if you like, centre forward. Frankly, if we don't, I don't see us scoring enough goals to mount a viable challenge in what will be a difficult league.
Couldn't agree more with your points Geoff. What a shame for all that Ade and Dave W couldn't settle their differences for the good of the individuals the club and the supporters.
Did anyone go along to the open trial last night? just wondered who turned up.
Interesting reading the Lee Carey comments in the observer today. Doesn't want to play Ryman south! I would have thought that was the perfect level for him. I have never been Lee's biggest fan as people know although the lad never gives less than 110% on the field and i'm sure he's a good lad. He is not a natural leader and just disappears way to often in too many games. The observer report that Razor is very disappointed about his possible departure, really!!! I say thanks very much for all you have done Lee and good luck to where ever you may go but lets rebuild that midfield around Timmy and Danny Ellis and not lose too much sleep over his departure.
Totally agree John. I don't want a player who can't accept responsibility for getting us relegated, along with the rest of the squad and management, and won't stay to put the club back in the premier division.
I think it revealing that until today's Observer article and John's comments above there had been little if anything said on the Forum about whether Lee might be with us for the upcoming season. Possibly, that reflects mixed feelings about Lee's performance last season. I very much wanted him to do well; like John, I thought he tried hard, was professional and disciplined; and, on occasion, delivered a really great performance. However, there were indeed too many games when it just did not happen for him. How much of that was down to him or to a midfield which seemed to lose its way as the season wore on is moot.
I hope all goes well for Lee next season wherever he might be. Perhaps playing in a different midfield with a different coach will enable him to consistently deliver his best.
Personally never been a fan of Lee's, but what does shock me are his comments regarding relegation, especially as he was team captain. Yes he started the season well, but towards the end, he would of been lucky to get in a Ryman South team. Totally agree with JohnW, build around players who want to stay and play for the team. Rant Over. Cheers
I am sad that Lee has departed, in my opinion one of our better players but that's football I guess. He wants to player higher than Ryman South, fair enough, personally I think he would have stood out in that league and his performances would have been better. As said previously gave 100% and think if managed right would have still been an asset. Laptop has also found himself a new club which staggers me. After two relegations and numerous lower level clubs somehow he has landed a role with Bromley FC in Conference South. Glad to see his self promotion has got him another job so soon, must be the best Salesman ever!
Have to say I am also sorry to see Lee go. Over the season I think his contribution greatly exceeded that of either Tom or Jamie. He distributed well from in front of the defence and in many respects I felt he was our only real 'play maker'. He made and scored a few great goals from dead balls but admittedly too many were wasted over the course of the season. I'd put him on a par with Danny for the season which actually makes him one of our midfield successes. Are we going to be able to replace him with anyone better, I wonder ? Tim certainly won't make or score as many over the season...so where are our midfield goals going to come from ?
Not very often I disagree with you Mick but actually don't agree with anything you have said. He scored 3 goals in 52 appearances and one was a penalty. I'll have a wager with you that Tim scores more than 3 over the season. And I think if the likes of Danny and Jack had the opportunity to take more corners and free kicks last season, we would have scored more.
Although Lee did much of his work deep in his own half he was the most creative of our midfield players. He didn't especially stand out in our last Ryman South campaign so I am surprised he isn't staying with Hastings to show his detractors his best form. Will now need to look for a midfield player with the ability to pass well.
although not what you wanted to hear from lee how many times have I read on the forum you cant blame a player for wanting to play at a higher level.what about the players that have gone ,they were all in the same team that got relegated and I for one wanted them to stay and and get us promotion but they didn't.
Well it's all about the replacement now.... Can't think of anyone that I know of that's is of the same style so will be a test of Sean's scouting network now.
Dan's query raises an interesting point. Do we actually want a like for like replacement for Lee? As my earlier posting suggested I think Lee has considerable ability; but for much of the last season (particularly the second half) that did not translate into effective performances; either by him as an individual or by the midfield as a whole. Lee was the ball player and when it went well it went very well; but all too often it didn't. Up against stern opposition we retreated; lost possesssion; were slow to get back and defend; and were even slower to mount an effective counter attack; becoming over elaborate with passing while the opposition re-grouped.
I would prefer to see a more direct approach in midfield. For that reason I am pleased that Tim and Danny will be present. I would also like to see another combative midfielder available for selection. That could be Jamie; but, to be frank, I didn't think the second half of his season gone was as good as it might have been. Again, what of that was down to him and what to the tacticts the team adopted is uncertain to me.
Antony Storey was obviously a much better player than Lee at his peak and was still doing a good job for Rye last season. Not sure how old he is now but there would be a lot more noise on the pitch if he was playing and he would probably manage to get quite a few opposition players sent off.
I believe this recent news about players moving on has nothing to do with Ryman South or Ryman Premier it's the fall out from being humiliated by the manager, and the dressing room fall outs that happened, and yes they did happen as some of us witnessed at Bognor for one. Players will be reluctant to sign for a manager who has so far failed in his first job at senior level. We will only attract players with money and too compete with Hythe and Leatherhead we will not only have to pay high wages, but the players will need to be off Ryman premier standard, as you can bet your life the team at the top will be better than the bottom four off the premier. Our best hope is too lose our 1st match in every cup meaning we only play 50 games. If we need the FA Cup money then sadly something has gone wrong. If we are up at the top of the division hopefully an extra 50 - 100 people will pay to get in generating extra income. Getting league crowds up to 450 - 500 is more important than a cup run and a mid table league position.
Just my opinion that Lee was one of our more effective midfielders. I felt Lee, along with Danny and Jack, were probably the pick of a fairly average bunch. Didn't realise Lee only scored three all season though. Just remember a cracker at Cray !
Clearly you are a Jamie fan.....we'll have to agree to differ on that one too.
IMO I'm 90% certain Jamie will go but would expect that Tom will stay, we would need at least 2 more players capable of playing wide ( either flank ) in addition though.
By the way I've changed my profile name as a user on the 'other' forum has been slagging me off amongst others anonymously and used it in jest but have decided to adopt it actually! :)
FAWLTY
"2 individuals on the other forum are at it again with the brainwashing. When Walter's has gone (And he will go ) these 2 should have no place in our club. They are constantly bashing the long term supporters. What a disgrace"
"Meanwhile I see the brainwashing continues on the other forum by Lenny the Lion and Desperate Dan"
"WALTER'S OUT WALTER'S OUT WALTER'S OUT"
"I suspect we will get more brainwashing from Lenny and Desperate about dis-loyal players"
"Would not surprise me now if Timmy O went to join Ade at Lewes, let's hope so"
"Yes more players gone and no others on the horizon. Any player reading this thinking about playing for the club please DON'T you will regret and there are no rewards"
"I hope you all join me in wishing them the very worst for the coming season"
Hope 'Fawlty' enjoys their one sided banter and personal jibes! With comments like that it makes me think Jez was a breath of fresh air!
Actively hoping that your side doesn't sign any classy players one moment then moaning about the lack of them the next seems especially stupid.
And any 'fan' wishing their team the 'very worst' needs to take a good look at themselves then look up the word 'support' in a dictionary!
There's one or two posters on the other forum whose views I respect greatly even if I don't agree with them like PhilG who I've always got on with well at matches but this 'Fawlty' who hides behind a TV character as his alias is defiantly not one of them.
Where have I been 'brainwashing' people? if I could I would have brainwashed a few more to help at the ground today!
All I do is state my opinion same as everyone else does on here. Looks like 'Fawltys' brainwashing himself into thinking that the club is North Korea and Walters is Kim Jong Il ( before he died )
It ain't perfect but there sure is a lot worse elsewhere! To be honest I don't really care who runs the club but I enjoy getting behind the team and getting involved in providing any help I can. Not sure what help 'Fawlty' has ever provided but im sure he will clarify.
Stay classy San Diego......
-- Edited by Desperate Dan on Saturday 29th of June 2013 03:50:41 PM
I agree with your point about crowds Chris, and mostly agree about your cup point though would personally only want to go out of Ryman and Sussex cup first rounds as FA cup is so valuable financially even in the qualifying rounds that it would be mad to not want to progress at least a couple of qualifying rounds in that too. ( not expecting to see anything quite like last seasons progess ever again though! )
I'm not a Jamie fan either unfortunately Mick. Love his attitude and he seems to love the club and supporters but we need a bit more than someone who just runs around all day picking up bookings. He actually scored just 2 goals in 53 appearances so no better than Lee. I guess he will always be remembered for his performance at Harrogate. Don't think we will see him again anyway.
Think Danny and Jack (who has now left)are terrific young players and I think if Vickers can get some discipline in his game and a run in the side he will also be a great asset. Saw him at Whitehawk on Boxing day and he was the best player on the pitch but barely saw him again all season. Understand he has a 7 game ban so if he does stay we probably wont see him until October.
Surprising no one has mentioned Freddie Warren on the forum. Best loan signing by far last season and a terrific little player in the middle. No chance of him coming back on an extended loan? he would be ideal in the middle along with Tim and Danny.
Can see Tom staying and would defiantly want Warren back too but would a north London based player want to travel that distance for every home match and training session regularly for Ryman South football?...
I very much agree the comments re Tom (He has great potential, I hope he stays and his discipline improves); and Freddie (I would like to see him again, but think there is little chance). Re. Jamie; I think (although I haven't looked at the stats) that his disciplinary record was better last season than the season before. I hope he stays; but his energy and commitment need to be better harnessed than they were last season.
Let the children have their moan Dan or may I call you desperate? It's like the bash street kids with PLUG as the leader. I would love to know exactly where I or anyone else has been brainwashing people, and if ever the mysterons ever did take over the club they should never flatter themselves to think that I would be willing to help out in any shape or form. What I can't understand is if they can't stand the way things are run then don't come along and pay to watch, its that simple. I know that if I wasn't happy with the way something was run or the service it provided then I wouldn't be willing to part with my cash to fund it would you? Fondest regards Lenny.
"Yes more players gone and no others on the horizon. Any player reading this thinking about playing for the club please DON'T you will regret and there are no rewards.
I suspect we will get more brainwashing from Lenny and Desperate about dis-loyal players."
I can accept that supporters are worried. I am too - make no mistake about that. I took a few months off as I cant get my head around this culture that suggests that if you stick up for the club you are a puppet and if you criticise it, you are not a true supporter. I'm quite happy to debate with anyone, and also accept their views. That is what a forum is for. Lenny and Desperate have only tried - as I have in the past to provide a balanced argument. We are not the club, but if we stick up for our views that can only be expected. Every supporter on this forum without exception has the best interests of Hastings United at heart. Some I agree with and some I dont but thats again what a forum is for.
But to actively go on a forum and wish your side the worst for the season and hope that players dont sign is completely unacceptable. That is not a supporter in my book at all. Disgraceful.
Certainly didn't come across that well in print and i'm very surprised myself that its happened that way, thought it would have been good for Lee to push on and have a cracker of a season so he can prove that he is a good player for us as he proved the season before last by winning the POTY award.
I know he wasn't everyone's favourite last year but I thought he could help get us back up so I am personally gutted especially as I was his shirt sponsor last season!
It would seem, from comments above, that there are those whose evidently think it in the best long term interests of the club to do what they can to cause the present mamagement / ownership regime to fail; presumably in the hope that something more to their liking will emerge from the ruins. I think that not only disgraceful as Pat says above, but also folly. A club such as ours can very easily cease to exist altogether. Whatever anyone thinks of the present structure it is solvent and viable. An alternative might well be neither of those.
"Yes more players gone and no others on the horizon. Any player reading this thinking about playing for the club please DON'T you will regret and there are no rewards.
I suspect we will get more brainwashing from Lenny and Desperate about dis-loyal players."
I can accept that supporters are worried. I am too - make no mistake about that. I took a few months off as I cant get my head around this culture that suggests that if you stick up for the club you are a puppet and if you criticise it, you are not a true supporter. I'm quite happy to debate with anyone, and also accept their views. That is what a forum is for. Lenny and Desperate have only tried - as I have in the past to provide a balanced argument. We are not the club, but if we stick up for our views that can only be expected. Every supporter on this forum without exception has the best interests of Hastings United at heart. Some I agree with and some I dont but thats again what a forum is for.
But to actively go on a forum and wish your side the worst for the season and hope that players dont sign is completely unacceptable. That is not a supporter in my book at all. Disgraceful.
what I find hard to take pat is the team weren't good enough to keep us in the premier,but the ones that have gone believe they are good enough to play at a higher level ,so while they go on we have to watch OUR team play at a lower level because they don't wish to help us get back up there so much for the supporters eh or am I misguided and naïve.
Geoff, I guess there are always supporters who are disenchanted with whatever current regime is in place (in any club) - especially when things arent going well. We are no different, but I honestly think that even those who wish for regime change would not go as far as wishing their team to fail. I have chatted to many supporters over the last few years on both sides of the fence, and none of them would wish their team ill, apart from this one who cannot be regarded as a supporter in any way shape or form.
Dave, you are not misguided or Naive mate. As Dan says, some would have been let go and some would have naturally moved on, but it is disappointing when the club captain makes comments like that in the paper. I like him, and always have time for him but think his comments were unfortunate to say the least.
To wish the team you support relegation and to encourage players not to sign for the club and go elsewhere just shows how pathetic these people are. Correct me if I'm wrong but up to now I've not, as far as I'm aware, slated or had a go at the long standing supporters as suggested on the Beano forum but then again I wouldn't call those supporters coming out with such stupid comments. As for me having a go at those players leaving, they obviously don't know me as again that's something I have never done with any first team player, I know all of them and get on well with them all. Unlike the Bash street kids I understand players want to play at the highest level possible and I certainly would never criticise them on a public forum, of course I would dearly love to have all the best players playing for us but I'm wise enough to know players move on all the time, its a fact of the game.
